Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

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Guy Rowland
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Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Guy Rowland »

Image

Well this is unexpected. Korg have started doing non-Korgs. Three new products are in the coming Collection 5:

EP-1
VOX Super Continental
ARP 2600

Not yet sure what the EP-1 is (Korg do have an EP-1 sound engine for their Nautilus series), but the other two are definitely non-Korg, aren't they? On the ARP 2600:
At Superbooth 2024, we're previewing the KC ARP 2600: true to the original sound and character, with thoughtful modifications and additions.

We spent months understanding every detail of the original and modern schematics, studying manuals, testing with oscilloscopes, and most importantly listening. This is the only ARP 2600 plug-in that can faithfully recreate all 100 sounds in the original 2600 Patch Book. Extensive anti-aliasing techniques deliver truly premium audio quality. KC ARP 2600 adds both classic modifications and entirely new modules, while preserving the distinctive character and design philosophy of the original instrument.
Coming "Early Summer 2024".
https://www.korg.com/us/news/2024/0514/


Lawrence
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Lawrence »

I love combo organ, so I’ll be interested in the Vox Continental.


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by IFM »

Korg’s VIs sound amazingly close or the same as the original. Heck I have a vintage MiniKorg 2 and the vi sounds the same only more reliable.


Lawrence
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Lawrence »

The MiniKorg was my first sorta synth. I say sorta because it was somewhere between a single oscillator synth and an organ.


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Guy Rowland
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Guy Rowland »

I didn't know this, but apparently Korg now own ARP and Vox brands, which makes a bit more sense of this release.


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Guy Rowland
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Guy Rowland »

The Collection 5 is live now. Intro price $299, upgrade prices here - https://korg.shop/software/korg-collect ... ducts.html

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mickeyl
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by mickeyl »

Does it sound any better than the CherryAudio 2600 variant? While they receive a lot of praise for their VSTs, in my ears all of those sound pretty much the same and usually nowhere near the emulated hardware.
Cheers,

Dr. Michael Lauer – My Music


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Guy Rowland
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Guy Rowland »

mickeyl wrote: Jul 19, 2024 2:31 am Does it sound any better than the CherryAudio 2600 variant? While they receive a lot of praise for their VSTs, in my ears all of those sound pretty much the same and usually nowhere near the emulated hardware.
I'd be surprised if it didn't get a lot of plaudits over the Cherry and Arturia. They're talking a good game:
Our engineers spent considerable time understanding every detail of the original and modern schematics, poring over the original 2600 manuals, testing with oscilloscopes, and most importantly listening.The original AR and ADSR envelopes, for example, might seem simple – but it took a lot of time and tweaking to get them just right. The oscillator waveforms are correct, including the slight imperfections that add a unique brightness (especially for the triangle and sine). We modeled both of the original VCF modules, the 4012 and the 4072, with a switch to select between them. We included all of the many saturation points on the original hardware, with subtle distortions that bring life to the sound. Extensive anti-aliasing techniques spread throughout the different modules let us deliver truly premium audio quality. KORG’s Component Modeling Technology (CMT) includes variations between analog components, just as you’d find with multiple hardware 2600s, to deliver natural richness when playing polyphonically.

Outside the patch panel, there are 20-odd Trim Pots to select between behaviors of different 2600 vintages, dial in calibration details such as square wave width and triangle wave symmetry (just like the original hardware), and more.

Even more than most vintage synths, the 2600 has a character all its own. To begin with, no two sections are alike; each has its own purpose (often more than one) and capabilities to match. Each of the three VCOs has different features.The two envelopes work very differently. There are many hidden quirks, such as different ranges for identical-looking control inputs, phase inversions, and unusual waveforms. It’s a carefully considered instrument, but it also feels like a collection of bespoke modules. The differences guide the eye, and also simply make it fun to play around with. There’s a constant sense of discovery, of “wow, I can make it do that, too!”

When adding all of the new capabilities, we were determined to preserve the spirit of the original instrument. So, we resisted the modern urge to unify and standardize. Each of the VCOs is still different. When we added an envelope and an LFO, we made sure that they were different from the originals, enabling new sounds instead of just “more.” When we added a second filter, we made it entirely different from the main VCF. Each new feature speaks with its own voice. All of the additions have sensible normalled connections, incorporating the new LFO, envelope, and sequencer.

We also kept all of the controls of the original instrument, and even with all of the additions, we preserved the basic layout. If you’re familiar with the old 2600, or KORG’s new 2600 FS and 2600 M, you’ll feel right at home – but with even more to play with. .
Sounds wonderful, doesn't it?

But I sometimes think these things do get a bit overblown in terms of sonic expectations. For pure fun I have Arturia's Jean Michel Jarre tribute bank, and stuff like the Magnetic Fields I arp sounds essentially identical to the record to my ears, and that uses their somewhat derided ARP 2600 VST.


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Guy Rowland
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Guy Rowland »



I'm not trying to access the site yet, apparently its down (may be related to this global IT outage)


wst3
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by wst3 »

By far the emulation that is closest in sound to my ancient 2600 is the TimewARP 2600. But that doesn't mean that the others are bad. I like the Cherry Audio 2600, I like the Arturia, they do different things, and they do capture the spirit of the original.

I don't know which version of their collection I have their licensing has been confusing since the start. I'll find out, but I suspect I will simply add the 2600 to my arsenal.


JohnS
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New Korg collection 5

Post by JohnS »

Hi I do not know what is update yet , but everything works 100% except Arp2600
As soon as it is loaded every sound crackles like hell.
There is defintely a serious fault with this
I have the whole korg collection and this is the only synth that misbehaves.
I have a fast computer and also run arturia without any hitches.
Can anyone shed any light on this??


All the Best
John


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Guy Rowland
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Re: New Korg collection 5

Post by Guy Rowland »

Mods, perhaps merge this with the other Korg thread here? https://thesoundboard.net/viewtopic.php ... c1143fefdc

John, I've read elsewhere that the Arp is EXTREMELY CPU intensive, even when idle. Forensic emulations can be thirsty, but mothing should eat much cycles when idle, so it sounds like there's work to do by Korg.


JohnS
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Re: New Korg collection 5

Post by JohnS »

Hi Guy

I do have the Arturia collection an there is nothing wrong with that, and Sampletank and Izotope plugins.
I went and saw the summer offer and decided to upgrade but Korg have just added 3 new synths which i have in Arturia.
I feel a bit of a mug upgrading.
All Korg synths are 100% except the Arp 2600.
Yes it crackles even when idle
I have got the latest Focusrite drivers and run everything at 256 samples with no problems.
Will i get anywhere if i write to Korg as people in general say Korg are hard to contact.

All The Best
John :)


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by JohnS »

Hi Forum
Hi I do not know what is in update yet , but everything works 100% except Arp2600
As soon as it is loaded every sound crackles like hell.
There is defintely a serious fault with this.
I have the whole korg collection and this is the only synth that misbehaves.
I have a fast computer and also run Arturia without any hitches.
Can anyone shed any light on this??
I run a Focusruite with latest drivers and have a fast machine and run everything at 256 samples.32 ram
I do have Atruria Arp 2600 and there is no problems at all , infact all of my Arturia plugins work 100%
Izotope runs well all all other plugins, no problem.
There is a intense crackle problem with this plugin


All the best
John

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mickeyl
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by mickeyl »

The 2600 VST plugin seems to have problems (in Komplete Kontrol), the AU one is fine here.

That said, apart from TimeWarp2600 this sounds way better than all the competitors – and it's not only the programming, the raw sound seems much more beefy.
Cheers,

Dr. Michael Lauer – My Music


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by JohnS »

Hi Mikeyl

It is all a little clearer now as i should of said it crackled like hell in standalone mode using my Focusrite and at no matter what samples i used.
I have an Arturia 49 Essential linked up and a Yamaha Genos.
Every Synth i have fro Arturia and Korg and Sampletank play flawlessly in standalone mode except the new Korg Arp2600
Today i tried the Korg Arp 2600 out in Cubase and it played without a crackle , but the meters max out to red and performs better on Max CPU protection as it just gets over three quarters on the scale .
This synth is very high on power usage and is at max.
Can Korg do anything to make this like the rest of their synths as i only use a quarter on the cpu scale in generaL.

All the best
John

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tack
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Re: New Korg collection 5

Post by tack »

Guy Rowland wrote: Jul 19, 2024 7:40 pm Mods, perhaps merge this with the other Korg thread here? https://thesoundboard.net/viewtopic.php ... c1143fefdc
Done. Thanks Guy.
- Jason


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by wst3 »

mickeyl wrote: Jul 20, 2024 6:20 am The 2600 VST plugin seems to have problems (in Komplete Kontrol), the AU one is fine here.

That said, apart from TimeWarp2600 this sounds way better than all the competitors – and it's not only the programming, the raw sound seems much more beefy.
I know it was expensive when first released, but I've never quite understood why it did not take over the world. It is a fantastic sounding VI, and it seems to be true to the original.

I happened to attend the AES or NAMM (can't remember which, damn I'm getting old) and was snagged by an old friend who was service manager at ARP in the early days. He was walking around with Jim Michmerhuizen, the author of the original 2600 manual. My friend was even more skeptical than I when Jim said the TimewARP 2600 was the real deal. We tracked down Wayout Ware and watched demos by the designer and Jim, and we both agreed it was awfully good. Maybe great.

I picked up the demo (on CD no less) and spent quite a few evenings playing with it. It was good, no, it was great. I confess it took a little time between the demo expiration and me finally plunking down my credit card. I'm cheap, and at that time my 2600 was still working :D

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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Ashermusic »

If I needed to get closer to a real Vox Continental than I can get with the Logic Pro Vintage Organ, which I don't, I would just get this.
https://www.acousticsamples.net/super2
Charlie Clouser: " I have no interest in, and no need to create, "realistic orchestral mockups". That way lies madness."

www.jayasher.com


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by danatkorg »

JohnS wrote: Jul 20, 2024 8:08 am Hi Mikeyl

It is all a little clearer now as i should of said it crackled like hell in standalone mode using my Focusrite and at no matter what samples i used.
I have an Arturia 49 Essential linked up and a Yamaha Genos.
Every Synth i have fro Arturia and Korg and Sampletank play flawlessly in standalone mode except the new Korg Arp2600
Today i tried the Korg Arp 2600 out in Cubase and it played without a crackle , but the meters max out to red and performs better on Max CPU protection as it just gets over three quarters on the scale .
This synth is very high on power usage and is at max.
Can Korg do anything to make this like the rest of their synths as i only use a quarter on the cpu scale in generaL.

All the best
John
Dan Phillips here, from Korg R&D in California, the team that created the ARP 2600 plug-in.

This is absolutely a CPU-heavy plug-in. That's the price for doing a real model of the 2600, with all of its saturating opamps and idiosyncratic modules. Even the envelopes are computationally expensive. Hopefully you'll find that the quality is worth the CPU cycles! More info here, along with some tips:

https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/a ... erformance
Dan Phillips
Manager of Product Development, Korg R&D

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Geoff Grace
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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by Geoff Grace »

Hey Dan, it's good to see you here. Glad to see you're still developing products for Korg.

I appreciate the link. Thanks for stopping by.

Best,

Geoff


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by JohnS »

Hi Dan

I understand now.
I can use the korg in Cubase without a hitch, but as you say the cpu is very high even on Cubase max protection.
As a standalone it is unusable.
What sort of computer in the future is going to handle this sort of cpu? Maybe we will see the Quantum Mark 1 :D

All the best
john

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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by mickeyl »

Hi Dan, long time no see (you might not remember, but we had some chats back in the days of the Oasys Blue Bomber and later the PCI card…).

FWIW, while CPU usage is relatively high indeed, it doesn't impose a problem here on Apple Silicon. A single instance seems to consume up to 20% of an M1 Max.
Cheers,

Dr. Michael Lauer – My Music


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by danatkorg »

mickeyl wrote: Jul 21, 2024 8:02 am Hi Dan, long time no see (you might not remember, but we had some chats back in the days of the Oasys Blue Bomber and later the PCI card…).

FWIW, while CPU usage is relatively high indeed, it doesn't impose a problem here on Apple Silicon. A single instance seems to consume up to 20% of an M1 Max.
Hi Michael! Good to hear from you again.

Yes, the M1 series does quite well. I have a two-year-old Mac Studio M1 Ultra here, and I just tried a project with 52 instances of ARP 2600, all at 4x oversampling, with 128-sample buffers. All 20 cores light up, but no overloads.
Dan Phillips
Manager of Product Development, Korg R&D


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Re: Korg Collection 5 inc ARP 2600

Post by danatkorg »

JohnS wrote: Jul 21, 2024 7:11 am Hi Dan

I understand now.
I can use the korg in Cubase without a hitch, but as you say the cpu is very high even on Cubase max protection.
As a standalone it is unusable.
What sort of computer in the future is going to handle this sort of cpu? Maybe we will see the Quantum Mark 1 :D
Standalone performance shouldn't differ significantly from plug-in use. My guess is that this is related to the audio driver settings in the standalone version.

On the Windows side, the latest i7 machines run the ARP 2600 very well.
Dan Phillips
Manager of Product Development, Korg R&D

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