NI to no longer allow registration of legacy products [NOW FIXED]

[Guy Rowland]

From NI:

As of May 31, 2020, a range of legacy products from Native Instruments and third-party manufacturers, as well as the activation tool Service Center, will be discontinued. This means that already installed and activated products can still be used without limitation, but it is no longer possible to reinstall or reactivate any of these products on a new computer.

Most of the products have a newer version with the same or enhanced functionality, either released by NI or one of our partners. Please check out our product pages, or ask the manufacturer of the original third-party library for a newer version or alternative libraries.

After May 31, 2020, the use of Native Access is required to activate and manage your NI products. If you are using an older operating system, you can find legacy versions of Native Access in this article - https://support.native-instruments.com/ ... 0000407909 .

Here is the list of discontinued products:

NATIVE INSTRUMENTS
Absynth 2
Absynth 3
Absynth Sounds Volume 1
AC-Box Combo
Akoustik Piano (before 1.1.0)
B4
B4 II
Bandstand
Battery
Battery 2
Battery Studio Drums
Electronic Instruments 2 XT
Elektrik Piano (before 1.5)
FM7
Guitar Combos
Guitar Rig
Guitar Rig 2
Intakt
Kompakt
Kompakt Sony ACID Pro
Komplete 2
Kontakt 1.0
Kontakt 2
NI Essentials
NI Spectral Delay
Plex Combo
Pro-52
Pro-53
Reaktor 2.3
Reaktor 3
Reaktor 4
Reaktor 5 (before 5.1.5.0)
Reaktor Electronic Instruments
Reaktor Electronic Instruments 2
Reaktor Session
Studio Collection
Traktor 3
Traktor DJ
Traktor DJ Studio
Traktor DJ Studio 2
Traktor DJ Studio 2.x
Traktor FS 1.5
Traktor FS 1.5
Traktor FS 2
Traktor Hercules
Twang Combo
Vokator

EAST WEST
Boesendorfer290
Colossus
EWQLSO Gold Ed
EWQLSO Gold Ed Pro XP
EWQLSO Silver Ed
EWQLSOSilver Ed Pro XP
Hardcore Bass
Hardcore Bass XP
Percussive Adventures
PSP Adrenaline
PSP Drumkit From Hell 2
PSP Percussive Adventures 2 LE
PSP Stormbreaks
PSP Vapor
Ra
SO Brass
SO Brass Pro XP
SO Percussion
SO Percussion Pro XP
SO Strings
SO Strings Pro XP
SO Woodwinds
SO Woodwinds Pro XP
Stormdrum
Stormdrum Intakt
Symphonic Choirs

BEST SERVICE
Artist Drums
Artist Grooves
Chris Hein Horns
Classical Collection
Cult Sampler
Ethno World 3 Complete
Galaxy Steinway
Galaxy Steinway 5.1
Latin World
Orient World
String Essentials

ZERO G
Altered States
Analogue Sequencer Loops
Beats Working in Cuba
Morhology
Nostalgia
Outer Limits
PSP Afrolatin Slam
PSP Koncept & Function
PSP Nu Jointz
PSP Vol 7 The Operating Table
PSP Wired - The Elements of Trance
Sounds of the 70s
Sounds of Polynesia
Vocal Forge

BIG FISH AUDIO
Celtic Instruments
First Call Horns
London Solo Strings
Raging Guitars

GARRITAN
Garritan Jazz
Garritan Personal Orchestra

ART VISTA
Virtual Grand Piano

COMPUTER MUSIC
CM Session

FUTURE MUSIC
Future Loops

TAP SPACE
Virtual Drumline 2

https://support.native-instruments.com/ ... 0006053397

[wst3]

Well that's a huge disappointment!

I still use some of these "legacy" products, although getting them authorized has always been a royal PITA. At least two of them are not easily replaced - Vokator and Spektral Delay. I'd add B4-II to the list, but I have found plugins that cover at least some of that sonic turf - sadly the organs from NI don't do a very good job.

If they wish to discontinue support that's fine, but they should provide perpetual licenses, not shut them down completely.

And just when I thought they might be getting a clue...

[1gc]

I also use many of these legacy products. Can anyone began putting out options for alternative ways to keep these in our systems?
g.c.

[Lawrence]

I don’t see the Art Vista VGP2 on the list. They better not put it there or I’ll, I’ll,...

fuss.

This is the problem with monopolies.

[Guy Rowland]

Just Stormdrum 1 lost for me, which I barely use any more. But I do own it, and the Kontakt side of it loads just fine.

It's spectacularly unethical. Shouldn't be legal.

[Guy Rowland]

In the case of East West, most (all?) of their products are now in Play. They should now honour Kontakt serial numbers for the equivalent Play version imo (or a major discount for Symphonic Orchestra elements). It's nowhere near as good of course, because of the lack of editing options and the fact old products won't load, but at least you have broadly the same content.

[Piet De Ridder]

We are royally fucked, aren’t we? Sample-library-reliant musicians, I mean. In just about every orifice. As if it’s not bad enough that we’re totally at the mercy of developers who get away, time and again, with selling flawed and unfinished product (and who rather release new stuff than address the errors and bugs in existing stuff), there’s also this, in my view loathsome, trend among several of them to sell their content in hermetically shielded systems which no longer allow us to use or customize the content in the way we’d like — editing at a sample level, bypassing scripts and sample remapping is all but impossible with the sample playback software from VSL, Spitfire, EastWest and OrchestralTools — and now we also have to lie down and roll over quietly while Native Instruments, unilaterally, puts an end to a license agreement of several dozens of products (many of them not even theirs); an agreement between seller and buyer that was, as far as I know, never understood to be finite. But NI decided that it is.

I have no doubt that they investigated all legal aspects of this decision thoroughly before announcing it, so probably there’s very little anyone can do, but my first reaction was also: “Can they actually do this?” (But I guess they can, Adobe has done it too.)

In related news: thus far, I’ve had no help from Native Instruments in getting my Spitfire Bespoke Chamber Strings re-authorized on my machine. The only software I could authorize that library with, was Service Center, but that application no longer runs in High Sierra. And when attempting to authorize it with Native Access, I get the error message that “the library is unknown”, even though it is listed under ‘My Products’ in my NI-account. Explaining all this to NI Support, the ’support’ they gave me was … that I should … install Native Access. That’s as far as my support ticket has gone. Since then: nothing.
I don’t know about you, but when given this kind of treatment, I start entertaining thoughts of wanting to bazooka NI Towers. In a manner of speaking of course.

But we’re expected to be fine with all this, aren’t we? Sell us faulty stuff, no problem. Take away the licenses we purchased, no problem. Provide support that is as insulting as it is unhelpful, no problem …

That’s what I find most depressing of all: this climate we’ve gradually entered into over the past decade that allows all this borderline-illegal, definitely immoral and unethical and totally unprofessional and profoundly disrespectful conduct to flourish — always at the customer’s expense — and we’re supposed to be silently OK with it. Dare to complain or protest, and you’re an ungrateful grumpy whiner.

_

[GR Baumann]

Exactly how I see it, thanks much Piet!

I agree with your Adobe analogy, it is pretty much the same.

That being said, NI has a history of this "behaviour", has it not? I remember vividly when they stomped the (Excellent!!!!) Kore hardware and support into the ground in favour of that Maschine gimmick.

I often wished for Eric Persing to invest into chamber and symphonic content as he is one of the very few developers that earned my 100% trust. (Smaller devs too of course, like Sean form Valhalla, or Andrew Sauter etc.)

[Mikeybabes]

All of a sudden, the decision of certain developers to bring their own sample player software to market seems to be more understandable. Despite the initial problems, which I know have been considerable, in the long run this seems a sensible route for them. At the moment their businesses are effectively a hostage to the decisions that NI make, both now and in the future.

Many at 'the other place' suggested that this was being done purely for financial reasons - but I always thought it was so developers held their own destinies in their own hands. I always thought that the costs of developing and maintaining their own players would be a be far more expensive route, at least in the short term.

Imagine NI in ten years time telling you <Insert library of your choice> can no longer be activated.

It's at times like this that the VSL route of a dongle becomes rather more attractive than would initially appear.

So I'm saddened, not terribly surprised, and will view NI with even more suspicion going forward.

As an owner of the Spitfire Symphonic Orchestra, I'm looking forward to the new upgrade - which I'm guessing will be for their new player, and the transition of the OT back catalogue to their new player.

[Guy Rowland]

Mikey - except there's absolutely no guarantees that any other company will change their rules. I'm starting to get very slightly jittery about VSL's VI player. There have been a lot of fire sales lately on legacy products. It wouldn't happen for quite some time still, but when they have a new platform they want everyone on....

Piet, yes we are, right royally. My situation with Stormdrum 1 is absurd peanuts compared to your Spitfire Bespoke license. You may have answered this already, but have you contacted Spitfire directly?

Meanwhile here's something I only just realised this morning. That Stormdrum library is actually currently licensed via Native Access. It works on their current licensing platform. So they are deliberately, as a matter of policy, actively withdrawing functionality to do this. It's not even just a case of being tied to an old product, Service Center, that they no longer wish to support, they are taking man hours to break things for their customers.

Also thanks to rrichard63 at VI-C, who highlighted these terms from NI's EULA - ""3.2 Native Instruments grants Licensee the non-exclusive right without restrictions in time or place to use the Products."

I started a thread at NI's forums here - https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... es.376981/ , asking for NI's response to how any of this is either legal or ethical.

[kpc]

We can all vote with our wallets and make sure NI knows that. They maybe the huge dog in the fight, but not the only dog.

If we could rally, similar to how we did with the Discover Channel and Your Future, we could out an end to this practice and stop future devs from doing the same. Not an easy task I know. But surely doable.

[riffwraith]

I also use many of these legacy products. Can anyone began putting out options for alternative ways to keep these in our systems?
g.c.

You don't need to worry about keeping them on your machines; once auth'd, they are there forever.

The issue is when you go and build a new machine. How to auth them then?

Well, you add them manually to the registry. At least on a PC. Not sure about a Mac. You have to know how to do it, but it isn't complicated. You do still need the serial # you received with your purchase, however.

Cheers.

[kpc]

Well, I will say this - I am going to think long and hard before buying another NI product.

[Guy Rowland]

I've just submitted this support request (suggest anyone affected by this does something similar:)

Hi, I have a license for East West Stormdrum 1, which is currently active via Native Access ( serial numbers supplied in support ticket ). However, I see you intend to remove my ability to activate this product from May this year. This means that when I next change computers, or upgrade mine, I will no longer use the product I paid for.

Under your EULA you state "3.2 Native Instruments grants Licensee the non-exclusive right without restrictions in time or place to use the Products." So your decision reads to me as you being in breach of your own EULA.

Could you explain to me, legally and ethically, why you have chosen to spend time and money actively withdrawing a product's authorisation and denying access to your customers' purchases? Further, can you explain how I can trust your company to continue to honour the licences for any of the many other products NI products I own?

Many thanks.

[X-bassist]

This actually begins a limit (maybe 10 or 12 years?) to how long libraries will be supported. I’m not sure why I expected it to be longer (probably because I still have working hardware that’s 30+ years old) but it should be a new factor when buying libraries. Sad to think many of my “new” libraries could be defuncted before 2030. In fact by then the cycle could be quicker with OS and multiple platforms (DAW, VE Pro, Komplete Kontrol, Kontakt, Play, etc) being changed all the time. We will probably look back in the future and long for the day software is usable after 10 years. All just to get a piano to play like my Steinway without all the weight- which, by the way, was built in 1918, and still works perfectly.

[Guy Rowland]

Matt from NI has responded, rather than paste it here (because I think this might well be a back and forth situation), start here - https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... st-1887475 .

They seem all over the place...

[playz123]

Well said, Guy...and a very polite offering under the circumstances. I've sent something to similar to NI.

I'm guessing many of the people on this forum have at least one or (many) more of those products, and they are still in use. I suppose my top concern is Chris Hein Horns, but I also have, and still use, several other products on the list. I certainly didn't need to be convinced that this is a DUMB move by NI. And Piet's mention of Adobe reflects another dumb move with which I've had to deal for more than a few years now...Adobe's subscription service. I refused to ever buy into it, so I'm still using CS5. But as it becomes more fragile, I'm using Affinity Designer and Photo more often. However, with the NI software, for much of it there really are no updated or newer versions of the same libraries. Anyway, guess rather than complain here, it would be more useful for me to direct my comments to the source of the problem...NI. Sure can feel the frustration here and elsewhere though, and IMHO it's definitely warranted.

[Guy Rowland]

I've literally just posted about Adobe Auditon on another thread, Frank! Yup, no way I'm subscribing at $20pm forever just to keep it working.

Can I check something? I have CHH Horns v2... is this an affected product do you think? I use that quite a bit, especially for layering. This all really crap...

[Quasar]

Matt from NI has responded, rather than paste it here (because I think this might well be a back and forth situation), start here - https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... st-1887475 .

They seem all over the place...

Typical corporofascist techno-speak, which has only become as tiresome as it is drearily predictable.

I wish people had gotten as up-in-arms over NI's betrayal of offline C/R activation, which was also spectacularly unethical, as they seem to be getting about this. But however you spin it, ALL of this comes down to implementing and shielding CP systems that do not work anyway, that do nothing to stop piracy, that only offer a mirage of security to fatten the wallets of a a parasitical sub-industry that makes money by spewing out various Kafkaesque DRM schemes.

But whatever. Though I have always avoided subscription services, dongles/iLok accounts, e-licenses, cloud-based monitoring etc., my mistake was in ever trusting any C/R system that depended on the magnanimity of a software company or a remote, 2nd-party server. I won't ever again purchase a VI or effect plugin that does not give me 100% local control over when, where or how I choose instantiate it. Simple like that.

[Mikeybabes]

I'm starting to get very slightly jittery about VSL's VI player. There have been a lot of fire sales lately on legacy products. It wouldn't happen for quite some time still, but when they have a new platform they want everyone on....

VSL have just released a new version of VI Pro that supports High DPI displays, but I do know that they have said they are not going to be developing the VI player further - though I'm not exactly sure what they could add as it is so comprehensive.....

As for NI, whatever the legal position, this is effectively a breach of trust - many of us have invested thousands in Kontakt sample libraries and now the company who owns the platform on which it all depends is showing itself to to be untrustworthy. It's pretty shabby.

[playz123]

I've literally just posted about Adobe Auditon on another thread, Frank! Yup, no way I'm subscribing at $20pm forever just to keep it working.

Can I check something? I have CHH Horns v2... is this an affected product do you think? I use that quite a bit, especially for layering. This all really crap...

I plan to check with Chris about this, but my CH Horns consists of 4 volumes....the first is "CHH Solo", then "Volumes 2 & 3" and then "Pro Volume 4". I know I updated the original 4 volumes at one point, but they were just some updates. On Chris' web site, the horns package is called "CHH Pro" and the differences from the very first series are the newer interface and some programming changes. Thus the confusion as to what NI is referring to as "Chris Hein Horns". Hopefully Chris can tell us more. All I know is that if I ever had to reinstall on a new computer, I would still need those original discs. And on NI, I have only ONE serial number and it just says Best Service "Chris Hein Horns", so that means I'd probably be out of luck if they stop authorizing my collection.

https://www.chrishein.net/web/CHH_Overview.html

[EvilDragon]

CHH V2 is not affected. It's the very first version of CHH that is affected. It seems to have been updated a number of times already.

[Lawrence]

I've literally just posted about Adobe Auditon on another thread, Frank! Yup, no way I'm subscribing at $20pm forever just to keep it working.

Can I check something? I have CHH Horns v2... is this an affected product do you think? I use that quite a bit, especially for layering. This all really crap...

I plan to check with Chris about this, but my CH Horns consists of 4 volumes....the first is "CHH Solo", then "Volumes 2 & 3" and then "Pro Volume 4". I know I updated the original 4 volumes at one point, but they were just some updates. On Chris' web site, the horns package is called "CHH Pro" and the differences from the very first series are the newer interface and some programming changes. Thus the confusion as to what NI is referring to as "Chris Hein Horns". Hopefully Chris can tell us more. All I know is that if I ever had to reinstall on a new computer, I would still need those original discs. And on NI, I have only ONE serial number and it just says Best Service "Chris Hein Horns", so that means I'd probably be out of luck if they stop authorizing my collection.

https://www.chrishein.net/web/CHH_Overview.html

I think the confusion comes regarding "v2" as opposed to "volume 2". I also have four volumes of Chris Hein horns, but the one in my template is "Volume 2", not "version 2", which I assume means I'm using CHH volume 2, not CHH version 2.

[Guy Rowland]

Wheels within wheels.... err... so... I have volume 2 as well, not version 2. In Native Access it is listed as Chris Hein Horns Vol 2 DE, so sounds like I'll still be able to use that one?

[playz123]

Wheels within wheels.... err... so... I have volume 2 as well, not version 2. In Native Access it is listed as Chris Hein Horns Vol 2 DE, so sounds like I'll still be able to use that one?

Chris will clarify as soon as he has had a chance to assess things further. With his permission I will post the information when I receive it. He was not aware of this until now and I understand he also needs to consult with Best Service. He's a real gentleman as you know, so I'm sure will help answer our questions.
Unfortunately it is not as clear cut as some suggest, since the versions that many people currently have are the latest but were built on the backs of the original volumes. Much depends on if one updated, bought new or what one bought new. As I stated earlier I only have one serial number on NI...the original one called Chris Hein Horns, yet I have the latest versions. Perhaps what you have, Guy, may possibly still be fine...I don't know, BUT regardless it's best I let Chris offer an explanation as to what will be okay and what will not. All this suggests to me that anyone with any of the original volumes still present may be affected. Beyond that, at this point we simply do not know.