The Sound Board

Synchron Solo Violin & Solo Cello

"11 mic positions (including 3 close mics), a large selection of presets including several positions on stage (center, solo, 1st chair).
8 short articulations in several variations, different sustains, legato with 3 vibrato options, lyrical legato, zigane legato, different dynamics, tremolos and measured tremolos, trills, pizzicatos, harmonics and more are included in these libraries. The cello also comes with a few effects articulations."

Update of the Synchron Player is mandatory as these new libraries need the new functionality (a.o. the new slot-crossfade editor).




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It's an impressive release. I wouldn't have posted this, as I can only repeat myself. But these libraries deserve comments. Even slightly critical ones.

I love these libraries on paper. It's a great selection of articulations. The sampling depth seems great. And VSL always pays attention to detail and quality control. That's all great. But when I listen to the samples, I am disappointed. I just don't like the sound. Listen to the direct comparison between live and samples. It's brutal:



The détaché sounds so sample-y in this comparison. I think it's because samples are agnostic to phrasing. If the musician plays the same phrase, it comes to life immediately. There's really no comparison.

I'm sure these are fantastic libraries. I just can't bring myself to agree with the aesthetics of the VSL recording engineers.

Has anyone bought these and is willing to share their opinion? I am looking for solo strings that work in the context of a string quartet. In my opinion, that's where the shortcomings of the samples are most apparent. I don't expect them to be much better than previous offerings. But I am hopeful that a breakthrough will come at some point.

Linos wrote: ↑Jul 02, 2024 2:27 pm It's an impressive release. I wouldn't have posted this, as I can only repeat myself. But these libraries deserve comments. Even slightly critical ones.

I love these libraries on paper. It's a great selection of articulations. The sampling depth seems great. And VSL always pays attention to detail and quality control. That's all great. But when I listen to the samples, I am disappointed. I just don't like the sound. Listen to the direct comparison between live and samples. It's brutal:



The détaché sounds so sample-y in this comparison. I think it's because samples are agnostic to phrasing. If the musician plays the same phrase, it comes to life immediately. There's really no comparison.

I'm sure these are fantastic libraries. I just can't bring myself to agree with the aesthetics of the VSL recording engineers.

This is very interesting. The short samples sound very good and close to the real player. However, as soon as any real playing takes place, the samples fall flat immediately.

This is probably a good collection of samples as a writing tool. Incredibly detailed list of articulations which should be handy for those who wish to write for solo violin with samples.

Linos, why do you say that you do not like the aesthetics of the VSL recording engineers? I am curious.

The recordings sound very good to me by any standards and certainly the same engineers record all of the music at the Synchron stage which is used in thousands of recordings for film and production music around the world.

Tanuj Tiku wrote: ↑Jul 04, 2024 11:27 am
Linos, why do you say that you do not like the aesthetics of the VSL recording engineers? I am curious.

The recordings sound very good to me by any standards and certainly the same engineers record all of the music at the Synchron stage which is used in thousands of recordings for film and production music around the world.

As someone who has recorded many times at Synchron, with the same engineers, I have no problem with their recording ability. So I would suggest that perhaps it is actually something else that you don't like.

Linos wrote: ↑Jul 02, 2024 2:27 pmwhen I listen to the samples, I am disappointed. I just don't like the sound. Listen to the direct comparison between live and samples. It's brutal:

...

The détaché sounds so sample-y in this comparison. I think it's because samples are agnostic to phrasing. If the musician plays the same phrase, it comes to life immediately. There's really no comparison.

I'm sure these are fantastic libraries. I just can't bring myself to agree with the aesthetics of the VSL recording engineers.

It's a really interesting example imo. Tonally and for the basic articulations it's amazing - damn near identical, so I don't see how it can be recording engineers.

But you're right when you say about the phrasing. That's always been the problem with almost all samples (with perhaps honourable exceptions for VIR Harmonic and Performance Samples). It's nearly always joining / mixing samples together that is the problem, not the samples themselves. And although progress has been made in ambient halls, they are still more challenging to make naturally flow than drier stages.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think there's anything wrong with VSL's recordings. It seems to me that Bernd Mazagg, VSL's chief recording engineer, has a modern recording aesthetic that emphasises the high frequencies. For me, it's most noticeable in the ensemble strings (the various Synchron Strings libraries and Duality Strings). It makes the Synchron libraries sound too bright for me and I would prefer a more neutral/balanced sound signature. I know there has been a trend in recent years, especially in trailer music, to make recordings sound bright. So it's not extraordinary what VSL does. It's just that my tastes haven't adjusted to the trends.

With these solo strings, I'm not even sure that's what's bothering me. The phrasing is certainly a big part of what I don't like. Her playing is so elegant, and the samples sound stiff and awkward by comparison. But there's also something in the sound that just doesn't suit my tastes.

Linos wrote: ↑Jul 04, 2024 1:36 pm Don't get me wrong, I don't think there's anything wrong with VSL's recordings. It seems to me that Bernd Mazagg, VSL's chief recording engineer, has a modern recording aesthetic that emphasises the high frequencies.

It would be interesting if you were to hear some of the music recorded there to see if it sounds the same to you. And if it doesn't, try to figure out where the bit you don't like occurs.

Linos wrote: ↑Jul 04, 2024 1:36 pm With these solo strings, I'm not even sure that's what's bothering me. The phrasing is certainly a big part of what I don't like. Her playing is so elegant, and the samples sound stiff and awkward by comparison.

That's what I think about all solo samples, and there is little you can do to change that.

But I haven't really thought about these yet...

Daryl wrote: ↑Jul 04, 2024 2:19 pm It would be interesting if you were to hear some of the music recorded there to see if it sounds the same to you. And if it doesn't, try to figure out where the bit you don't like occurs.

Good idea Daryl! Do you have something to share that you recorded at Synchron Stage? Do you work with Bernd Mazagg when you record there, or do you work with a different recording engineer?

I've worked with all of the engineers.

This (from the VSL competition) was recorded there. This was recorded by Tristan Linton.



And if you want something slightly more string-y, try this, recorded by Martin Weismayr.

And the latest thing I did with Bernd is The Acolyte (don't shoot the messenger) which you can probably find something online from.