Modern Scoring Strings

[The Saxer]

Looking forward to the official release of MSS tomorrow Feb. 15th

Theoretical

[Muziksculp]

Looking forward to the official release of MSS tomorrow Feb. 15th

Theoretical

So far yes, but hopefully it will be reality at some point today.

At least they didn't change the date from Feb. 15th to a later date. Fingers crossed they will stick to releasing it Today !

[Muziksculp]

https://audiobro.com/

Looking forward to watch new videos, listen to demos, and learn more about it, I think they are still not done with the full launch on their website, so maybe another hr. or so.

[Guy Rowland]

It's a lovely warm tone, eh? Here's the long-awaited legato video:



Seems very comprehensive and lots of control and variety. I'd have preferred some more single note exposed examples (like Andrew does for the Cresc/Norm/Accents. I don't yet have a full sense of how it would play under the fingers - sometimes it sounds better (eg 12.25) than others (eg 13.10 on the fast notes). Sometimes they use seemingly random port which always sounds distracting, but I don't think that shows any problem, just not great examples of it applied. The auto-divisi seems to work well even though its only 2 part.

[Pixelpoet1985]

@Guy

Are you planning to make a video on this, too? Would be nice. Your video on MSB was really helpful.

[mcalis]

I am still waiting on your video about radiators, Guy.

[Guy Rowland]

Hi you two - I doubt it, I'm not planning on buying it any time soon. I just can't face setting up another string library in the template! Have something like 10-12 of them already, I'm sure I'll get by.

I seem to go in waves, alternating between times when I say I won't buy anything but somehow do, and times when I really don't buy anything. I'm definitely in the latter camp right now.

[Jack Weaver]

I just can't face setting up another string library in the template! Have something like 10-12 of them already, I'm sure I'll get by.

Yeah, library purchase fatigue setting in.

.

[Markus K]

Apart from shying away having to set up and get used to such a big library again I'm unexpectedly very disappointed by most of what I hear from the first demos. It seems like that they kind of forgot during scripting all the features that in the end it is supposed to create music that sings and breathes. There might be a trade off between a lot of tweak ability and musicality in the samples. I don't know but it is a similar issue that vsl suffers from sometimes. Just IMO of course.
Anyway a clear pass for me which saves the wallet. This are the good news.

[Ashermusic]

No new strings libraries for me unless they include a paying gig.

[Guy Rowland]

Apart from shying away having to set up and get used to such a big library again I'm unexpectedly very disappointed by most of what I hear from the first demos. It seems like that they kind of forgot during scripting all the features that in the end it is supposed to create music that sings and breathes. There might be a trade off between a lot of tweak ability and musicality in the samples. I don't know but it is a similar issue that vsl suffers from sometimes. Just IMO of course.
Anyway a clear pass for me which saves the wallet. This are the good news.

I've been thinking about this post, and I can't figure out if I agree. The demos sound good to me, but - if you'll excuse the phrase - not orgasmically good. And what I can't decide is whether or not its the writing or the library. I genuinely don't know but I'm 60/40 its the writing. I think the opening of the legato video above is the best demo I've heard, and its not a demo. I don't hear anything in that that says sterile or unmusical, far from it.

You do hear the tricks quickly though. The opening of Wayward Runs sounds stunning, but within 15 seconds you're thinking "oh there it is again", which is the pitfall of nearly all runs in libraries. I'd have hoped with all the customisation and tweakablity the effect might have reduced a bit though.

Were I in the market for a string library, I think I'd go for it.

[Pablo Crespo]

I don´t know, I was convinced to buy it, but hearing things I don´t like. I don´t understand how Audiobro leaves the most crucial (and easy to do) demos in the hands of new users. Just a couple of dryish melodies highlighting the legatos, non-legato, note connections.

I cannot think that the legato engine can be worse than LASS, but it does sound strange.

[Linos]

Also quite odd that there isn't a single demo that zooms in on the divisi capabilities. Feature-wise this library is outstanding. It is incredibly comprehensive. But I am with you in having some reservations about the sound. For my tastes the sound signature is too dark, and somehow dense. Not enough clarity for me. And I also think the official demos mostly sound fine, but not exciting. With the prospect of Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings also featuring divisi, I am not buying Modern Scoring Strings if not user demos come around that knock me out.

Apart from the dark sound signature I am not quite sure what sets MSS apart from LASS. It has a few things that LASS doesn't (intuition patches, more aleatoric content, ostinato feature). On the other hand it has 'only' two part divisi over LASS's three. But basically it looks like much the same approach to sampling orchestral strings. There is even the same dry-ish sound with adding IRs (and later maybe color profiles) approach that LASS had. Somehow that never quite convinced me with LASS, and it doesn't here either.

[Guy Rowland]

I'm sure you've heard the divisi examples in the Legato video Linos, but thought I'd just check.

Actually I think there's quite a lot more stuff than LASS that you didn't mention - variable attacks, runs and scales etc. It is a lot more comprehensive, but does lack the 3 part divisi of course.

[Linos]

variable attacks

Ah, true. And that's quite a compelling one, actually.

Yes, I have heard the divisi in the walkthrough videos. But if you go to the length to record and program these, surely you must think they are an important feature for creating mockups. So why not show that in the musical context of the demos? Anyway, they will have had their reasons, and maybe a few more demos will pop up highlighting the divisi sections.

[Chapbot]

Hi you two - I doubt it, I'm not planning on buying it any time soon. I just can't face setting up another string library in the template! Have something like 10-12 of them already, I'm sure I'll get by.

I seem to go in waves, alternating between times when I say I won't buy anything but somehow do, and times when I really don't buy anything. I'm definitely in the latter camp right now.

Don't get it, you don't need it, anything you already have is better than this. I just got it and posted at VI control... I am super disappointed after having waited for literally years and feel I've wasted $549.

It may be called MSS but once you turn the three convolution reverbs off and bring up the close mic you have an incremental step from LASS. In fact, when they finally get around to updating LASS to version 3.0 sometime in the next decade I'm sure I'll use that instead of MSS.

The only thing I could ever see myself potentially using is the new intuition patches.

[Scoredog]

Hi you two - I doubt it, I'm not planning on buying it any time soon. I just can't face setting up another string library in the template! Have something like 10-12 of them already, I'm sure I'll get by.

I seem to go in waves, alternating between times when I say I won't buy anything but somehow do, and times when I really don't buy anything. I'm definitely in the latter camp right now.

Don't get it, you don't need it, anything you already have is better than this. I just got it and posted at VI control... I am super disappointed after having waited for literally years and feel I've wasted $549.

It may be called MSS but once you turn the three convolution reverbs off and bring up the close mic you have an incremental step from LASS. In fact, when they finally get around to updating LASS to version 3.0 sometime in the next decade I'm sure I'll use that instead of MSS.

The only thing I could ever see myself potentially using is the new intuition patches.

I could not do this with LASS

https://www.dropbox.com/s/91u5myfjt4uak ... 2.mp3?dl=0

not even close

[Jaap]

A very very happy user here. I am using it straight away in for an album I was asked to do by one of my publishers and though I have some good string libraries (LASS, CSS, HS and HZS, though the latter is maybe a bit of an oddball in the list), what I love about MSS is the extreme flexibility you have and all those great options with recorded ostinatos, runs, divisi, detune (awesome!), intuition patches, aleatoric etc etc just at your fingertips. They provided Expression Maps with the release and its a breeze that I don't have to set that up and can just work straight out of the box with it. It doesn't require the setup you had to do with LASS.

I personally like the tone. It's warm, full and rich and far less "harsh" as LASS can be. I don't understand why they have turned on 3(!) convo reverbs on the patches, but once you just select one from the many convo options (some really nice ones) or leave it off and run it through your own reverb setup, I find it beautiful and blending it now with CSB, CSW and some other things and that works lovely as well (though need a bit of work to make the room match, but that isn't any different then with using another library).

On VI I see a lot of fuzz about the legatos, but I never understood all the discussions about the legato (though I think they ment portamento). With some tweaking and carefull playing (like any other library) you can get very lovely results.

I am completely sold!

[Guy Rowland]

Well there's some mixed responses... fine and spirited work there, scoredog, though something about the runs is bothering me and I can't quite put my finger on what. But I totally agree that is territory that LASS shouldn't go anywhere near.

Very glad to read your report Jaap. 3 convos sounds nuts, I agree - a huge resource overhead and conceptually a very strange decision. With all those mic positions and a built in short tail, you just need 1 for long tail, right?

[Markus K]

I've been thinking about this post, and I can't figure out if I agree. The demos sound good to me, but - if you'll excuse the phrase - not orgasmically good. And what I can't decide is whether or not its the writing or the library. I genuinely don't know but I'm 60/40 its the writing. I think the opening of the legato video above is the best demo I've heard, and its not a demo. I don't hear anything in that that says sterile or unmusical, far from it.

You do hear the tricks quickly though. The opening of Wayward Runs sounds stunning, but within 15 seconds you're thinking "oh there it is again", which is the pitfall of nearly all runs in libraries. I'd have hoped with all the customisation and tweakablity the effect might have reduced a bit though.

Were I in the market for a string library, I think I'd go for it.

Guy, I have made some experiences with different libraries- not all that much. But one thing I learned is that if I have a feeling like the one I have when I listen to the MSS Demos/Videos I won't be very happy with the results I get. I will tweak and work around but there remains always that "not quite there" feeling. A frustrating and time consuming process. Its a bit like playing with musicians you don't feel comfortable with. You might discuss every note and phrase how it should be played but it never really takes off. Doesn't necessarily have to do with capability.
I didn't have that feeling with e.g. SCS. I still have to work on it but the results usually go in the right direction.
For sure one can get some work done with MSS but especially regarding the high expectations of the one string library that will end them all and which we all may dream of every now and then it seems not to be as far as my very humble judgement goes.

As a side note: I made a similar post yesterday and after clicking submit it was gone and didn't appear anywhere anymore as far as I can tell. Is this a familiar buggy behavior of the forum sometimes or did I do something wrong? Just to let you know. Nothing urgent

[Scoredog]

Hey Markus, nothing underhanded happened to your post, not sure it is there or not but it was not removed.

I like MSS but it is not going to be my only string library, it does have some very advanced tools.

[Muziksculp]

A very very happy user here. I am using it straight away in for an album I was asked to do by one of my publishers and though I have some good string libraries (LASS, CSS, HS and HZS, though the latter is maybe a bit of an oddball in the list), what I love about MSS is the extreme flexibility you have and all those great options with recorded ostinatos, runs, divisi, detune (awesome!), intuition patches, aleatoric etc etc just at your fingertips. They provided Expression Maps with the release and its a breeze that I don't have to set that up and can just work straight out of the box with it. It doesn't require the setup you had to do with LASS.

I personally like the tone. It's warm, full and rich and far less "harsh" as LASS can be. I don't understand why they have turned on 3(!) convo reverbs on the patches, but once you just select one from the many convo options (some really nice ones) or leave it off and run it through your own reverb setup, I find it beautiful and blending it now with CSB, CSW and some other things and that works lovely as well (though need a bit of work to make the room match, but that isn't any different then with using another library).

On VI I see a lot of fuzz about the legatos, but I never understood all the discussions about the legato (though I think they ment portamento). With some tweaking and carefull playing (like any other library) you can get very lovely results.

I am completely sold!

Hi Jaap,

It was very refreshing to read your post abut MSS here.

Most of the posts I have encountered on VI-C have been negative, or critical of the Legato, or other details about MSS. I don't have a clue what to make of all the negativity towards it.

I'm going to cautiously wait, and observe the user feedback about it, and then decide if I need it, or not. I'm also excited about the upcoming Sonokinetic Strings which has Divisi as well. It will be out in April.

If you have the time to post more feedback about your experience with MSS, I'm sure it will help better evaluate it.

Thanks,
Muziksculp

[Stakk]

I was looking forward to this release, but my personal reaction so far is frankly mixed with a little negative tilt. On paper spec this is such a wonderful and enormous library that does from (awesome) ostinatios to first chair to divisi to aleatoric with even various sus attacks. On the other hand, it sounds like not enough player performance/nuance is baked into the samples - that is, too surgical, or some describe it as synthy. There is not much feel of bowing motion that usually comes with a bit of "unexpected" baked-in player nuance in samples.

Surgicalness can be fixed somewhat by adding an EQ/filter movement or layering for additional "color motion", however:

Since MSS is intended to be a total control library rather than an out-of-the-box magic, a good programming could help a lot. But I'd rather prefer baked-in performances approach (like Orchestral Tools approach - various vibrato modes for sustains and legatos plus swells, or context-aware sampling like Spitfire or Performance Samples usually do) if I have to automate so much parameters or external EQ/filter to make it animated, even though it will give you a lot less freedom.

As for legato transition, it does sound like a bit overlappy. But I think it is less of a problem than performances being too surgical, because I usually fiddle around a lot with parameters like sample start (speed), volume and even adding SIPS'd stac overlay if needed.

[Chapbot]

A very very happy user here. I am using it straight away in for an album I was asked to do by one of my publishers and though I have some good string libraries (LASS, CSS, HS and HZS, though the latter is maybe a bit of an oddball in the list), what I love about MSS is the extreme flexibility you have and all those great options with recorded ostinatos, runs, divisi, detune (awesome!), intuition patches, aleatoric etc etc just at your fingertips. They provided Expression Maps with the release and its a breeze that I don't have to set that up and can just work straight out of the box with it. It doesn't require the setup you had to do with LASS.

I personally like the tone. It's warm, full and rich and far less "harsh" as LASS can be. I don't understand why they have turned on 3(!) convo reverbs on the patches, but once you just select one from the many convo options (some really nice ones) or leave it off and run it through your own reverb setup, I find it beautiful and blending it now with CSB, CSW and some other things and that works lovely as well (though need a bit of work to make the room match, but that isn't any different then with using another library).

On VI I see a lot of fuzz about the legatos, but I never understood all the discussions about the legato (though I think they ment portamento). With some tweaking and carefull playing (like any other library) you can get very lovely results.

I am completely sold!

Hi Jaap,

It was very refreshing to read your post abut MSS here.

Most of the posts I have encountered on VI-C have been negative, or critical of the Legato, or other details about MSS. I don't have a clue what to make of all the negativity towards it.

I'm going to cautiously wait, and observe the user feedback about it, and then decide if I need it, or not. I'm also excited about the upcoming Sonokinetic Strings which has Divisi as well. It will be out in April.

If you have the time to post more feedback about your experience with MSS, I'm sure it will help better evaluate it.

Thanks,
Muziksculp

When you just spent $549 for a library you've been anticipating for years and it sounds like 2010 then you'll understand the negativity LOL. In addition to the legato wonkiness I'd describe the tone as dated and static.

[Muziksculp]

A very very happy user here. I am using it straight away in for an album I was asked to do by one of my publishers and though I have some good string libraries (LASS, CSS, HS and HZS, though the latter is maybe a bit of an oddball in the list), what I love about MSS is the extreme flexibility you have and all those great options with recorded ostinatos, runs, divisi, detune (awesome!), intuition patches, aleatoric etc etc just at your fingertips. They provided Expression Maps with the release and its a breeze that I don't have to set that up and can just work straight out of the box with it. It doesn't require the setup you had to do with LASS.

I personally like the tone. It's warm, full and rich and far less "harsh" as LASS can be. I don't understand why they have turned on 3(!) convo reverbs on the patches, but once you just select one from the many convo options (some really nice ones) or leave it off and run it through your own reverb setup, I find it beautiful and blending it now with CSB, CSW and some other things and that works lovely as well (though need a bit of work to make the room match, but that isn't any different then with using another library).

On VI I see a lot of fuzz about the legatos, but I never understood all the discussions about the legato (though I think they ment portamento). With some tweaking and carefull playing (like any other library) you can get very lovely results.

I am completely sold!

Hi Jaap,

It was very refreshing to read your post abut MSS here.

Most of the posts I have encountered on VI-C have been negative, or critical of the Legato, or other details about MSS. I don't have a clue what to make of all the negativity towards it.

I'm going to cautiously wait, and observe the user feedback about it, and then decide if I need it, or not. I'm also excited about the upcoming Sonokinetic Strings which has Divisi as well. It will be out in April.

If you have the time to post more feedback about your experience with MSS, I'm sure it will help better evaluate it.

Thanks,
Muziksculp

When you just spent $549 for a library you've been anticipating for years and it sounds like 2010 then you'll understand the negativity LOL. In addition to the legato wonkiness I'd describe the tone as dated and static.

Hi @Chapbot,

I totally get it that you are not happy with MSS. I'm reading mixed feedback about it, but mostly on the negative side. I think it's a library that needs to be edited by each user to their taste, and might require more time massaging it. I doubt it is a useless library, I'm guessing it's just not an easy library to get instant wonderful results from.

I have decided to stay away from MSS, at least for now, and use my current collection of Strings libraries, and make music, instead of dealing with learning a new, costly, complex, and not so much rewarding library like MSS.

Having said that, I'm still interested in what LASS 3 will offer, but it won't be out until the end of this year.

The other Strings libraries I'm excited about are :

* Sonokinetic Strings, they will also offer Divisi Strings (Due in April).

* Also looking forward to see OT-Berlin Strings, and its expansions in SINE format.

* Updates to some of my current Strings libraries, that will further improve them.

* CineSamples : CineStrings Pro , might surface sometime this year.

* VSL : Maybe some new Synchron based string libraries, i.e. Synchron Chamber Strings, Synchron Solo Strings, ..etc.

* Spitfire Audio Abbey Road Modular Orchestral Strings. Not sure when we can expect this, but I'm interested.

Cheers,
Muziksculp